ID help please for some Austrian Alps species

[selbypaul]

Hi everyone
I've just returned from the Austrian Alps. I'll post full details of the trip in the next week or so, in my blog. But before I do, I could do with some help from the collective expertise on this forum. In terms of specific location, in case that helps, all photos were taken in the hills around the town of Mallnitz in central Austria.

This first one, labelled "Individual 1" I think I've narrowed down to either: a) Alpine Grizzled Skipper; b) Large Grizzled Skipper; or c) Carline Skipper. The maps suggest it shouldn't be c) though.

Individual 1

This second one, two photos labelled "Individual 2" I think I've narrowed down to either: a) Dusky Grizzled Skipper; b) Olive Skipper; or c) Warren's Skipper.

Individual 2 - top side

Individual 2 - under side

This third one, labelled "Individual 3" is probably too blurry for ID, sadly it was my only photo. I think I've narrowed it down to either: a) Large Grizzled Skipper; b) Olive Skipper; or c) Alpine Grizzled Skipper.

Individual 3

The fourth one, labelled "Individual 4" is I think a Lesser Mountain Ringlet. But would be good to have that confirmed.

Individual 4

The fifth one, labelled "Individual 5" I'm not sure of. We saw loads of Heath Fritillary all week. But this one has more varied colouring. Is it something different?

Individual 5

The next photo is of two individuals, labelled "Individuals 6 and 7." I'm assuming that they are the same species as they were displaying to each other. However I'm really struggling with these, and haven't been able to narrow down the ID.

Individuals 6 and 7

The next two photos are of the same "Individual 8." I note the cell spot on the under side photo, and the top side photo is limited. Is it just a Common Blue, or could it be a Turquoise Blue or Eros Blue?

Individual 8 - top side

Individual 8 - under side

"Individual 9" is an odd one. There were lots of Pearl Bordered Fritillary in the same area. But this one seems different. The black spots seem larger, and some seem more oblong. Is it just an aberration, or could it be a different species?

Individual 9

The two photos of "Individual 10" are the most interesting. My initial inkling was that it was one of the main holiday targets, a De Lesse's Brassy Ringlet. But I'm now more inclined to say Silky Ringlet.

Individual 10 - top side

Individual 10 - under side

The final photo, "Individual 11." is probably not good enough for ID. But I note the black mark within the mainly grey underside. So I'm guessing Common Brassy Ringlet

Individual 11

All identification advice will be gratefully received about any of the above. Thanks in advance!
Best Wishes
Paul

[David M]

I'm not confident enough to pronounce on your first pyrgus, Paul, but your second has a look of cacaliae. Duskies are chunky little skippers though which should rule out your other two choices. Can you recall whether this was large in size for a pyrgus?

Your third pyrgus may well be andromedae, with that contrast between bold forewings and obscure hindwings. Did you get any other image?

[selbypaul]

I'm not confident enough to pronounce on your first pyrgus, Paul, but your second has a look of cacaliae. Duskies are chunky little skippers though which should rule out your other two choices. Can you recall whether this was large in size for a pyrgus?

Your third pyrgus may well be andromedae, with that contrast between bold forewings and obscure hindwings. Did you get any other image?

Thanks David. I would agree with you on both the 2nd and 3rd pyrgus ID suggestions. I've seen cacaliae once before, and that was my impression when I saw this one. Similarly for the 3rd, my instinct told me andromedae when I first saw it, but pyrgus blindness set in after spending too much time looking through photos and ID books!

[Padfield]

Hi Paul. Sorry - I didn't notice these until just now. Unfortunately I haven't got time tonight to take a proper look at the difficult ones, but I can instantly add that your last ringlet is definitely gorge and that the pair of skippers 6 and 7 are definitely serratulae. The blue looks most like eros, and if the habitat/altitude was right, that must be what it is (the only alternative, as you say, is icarus). Instant view on the heath frit says just that - female athalia - and of the ringlet above that, epiphron (but I might revise that opinion). Skipper 2 (individual 2) I would agree cacaliae. One good feature is the lack of a strong spot at the base of s.2 on the underside hindwing.

Guy

[selbypaul]

Hi Paul. Sorry - I didn't notice these until just now. Unfortunately I haven't got time tonight to take a proper look at the difficult ones, but I can instantly add that your last ringlet is definitely gorge and that the pair of skippers 6 and 7 are definitely serratulae. The blue looks most like eros, and if the habitat/altitude was right, that must be what it is (the only alternative, as you say, is icarus). Instant view on the heath frit says just that - female athalia - and of the ringlet above that, epiphron (but I might revise that opinion). Skipper 2 (individual 2) I would agree cacaliae. One good feature is the lack of a strong spot at the base of s.2 on the underside hindwing.

Guy

Thanks so much for this Guy, that is really helpful. My hunch with the last Brassy Ringlet was also gorge. I'm happy with your IDs on Skippers 6 and 7 and on the Eros Blue too, given the altitude/habitat. Also the female Heath Fritillary, and skipper 2, cheers.

Much appreciated.

[selbypaul]

So, thanks to the UK Butterflies "hive mind" (thanks David and Guy), the only ones that still need identifying are Individuals 1, 9 and 10 above.

I sadly haven't got any better photos of Individual 1, so it may be difficult to ever confirm ID.

The key one I'd like identifying though is Individual 10. Is it a Silky Ringlet, De Lesse's Brassy Ringlet, or something else?

[Padfield]

Sorry - by ‘last ringlet’ I meant individual 10. That is gorge. Too much haste in replying. The very last one does look like one of the brassies.

I replied in haste as I was preparing to leave for Málaga, where I have just landed ...

Guy

[selbypaul]

Sorry - by ‘last ringlet’ I meant individual 10. That is gorge. Too much haste in replying. The very last one does look like one of the brassies.

I replied in haste as I was preparing to leave for Málaga, where I have just landed ...

Guy

Ah, no worries, thanks Guy. Enjoy the Malaga area!