Carline Skipper?

[David M]

As ever, I have a few pyrgus posers from my jaunt to the French Alps.

The nearest 'fit' for both these insects is carlinae, but I'd welcome any feedback. They were 'medium' sized, i.e, somewhere between malvoides and carthami.

This individual was seen taking moisture from a path at 1,500m:

This one, by contrast, was found in a grassy area at 2,500m:

[Roger Gibbons]

I would say the second one is serratulae (90%) and so probably is the first one (75%), based mostly on clues from the underside. The upperside of this species is much more variable than the books will tell you.

Roger

[David M]

Thanks, Roger. Yes, the undersides are certainly more the markings and ground colour of serratulae, but the books always depict the uppers with quite faint spots, whereas these two have fairly well developed ones.

[Padfield]

I agree they're both serratulae - though in fact I'm more comfortable with the first, which more closely matches the Swis serratulae I'm used to. Serratulae is often the default after other things have been eliminated, being itself a very variable butterfly. As a rule, the hindwing uppersides are less well marked than in either of these (surprising how these mimic carthami!) but the forewings may often be quite boldly marked. In Switzerland it flies from the valley to the mountaintops.

Guy

[David M]

Thanks, Guy. I'm aware that carlinae has quite reddish undersides (at least those that I have seen) but I have very little experience of serratulae so this will very much help going forward.